I apologize for the spam, but I'm going to post this discussion in a couple of different groups, as there doesn't seem to be a group for discussing the site itself.
I ran into an interesting idea today that I hadn't heard discussed before. A little backstory:
I've posted quite a few of my personal images in my portfolio here on Fstoppers. Some, a recent photoshoot I set up with a local model, turned out well and I am very proud of them. A couple even earned me my first 4 star ratings from anyone here on the site. Overall, I hover around a 3 star rating average, which I'm proud of, as that implies that I'm averaging portfolio worthy work according to the Fstoppers system with room for improvement towards greatness, with some definitely needing improvement. Given that I have relatively few ratings, my average is subject to failry large swings every time a new member takes a look at my portfolio, as happened this afternoon, when someone found 4 of my best images and, for whatever reason, rated them 1 star. Now, I'm not here to discuss why this person rated 4, very clearly staged, lit and post-processed images as "snapshots" but to bring up a larger problem with the rating system that I had never considered.
I was talking to my girlfriend about the site and the turn of events with my portfolio and she searched me out on Google and found my portfolio. Her first response was "You should change your name on Fstoppers". I was naturally confused and here was her rather compelling response. "When I, or anyone else, searches for you on Google and clicks on this site, the first thing I see is this 3 star rating." I attempted to explain the Fstoppers system to her and she hit me with this: "I don't know anything about their system, I just know I probably wouldn't hire a '3 star' photographer".
I've been thinking about this all day and I think she's right. We live in a world where people won't hire an Uber driver with less than 4.8 out of 5 stars and yet, here on Fstoppers we have a system where the highest rating I've ever seen is 4.3 and most hover very near the 2.5-3.5 range out of 5 even with great work. While I understand the rating system, I now realize anyone I meet on the street, or any prospective clients I have who decide to search me out instead of going straight to my curated website, will not have any understanding of this system. Not only is it difficult to get higher ratings as the upper tier is so subjective, there are far more people who will vote you a 1 for an unfavored comment, an attempt to game a contest or other reason, than who will ever give you a 5 for being a nice person. It's almost impossible to obtain a rating on this site that aligns with the expectations of the everyday Google user.
I apologize in advance for the super long post, but I'd be interested to hear feedback from the community on whether this issue has ever come up and if you do anything to combat it. I notice there are a lot of profiles on this site that have no portfolio images posted and I wonder if this is part of the reason why. I think this could be an interesting and necessary discussion to have. I would never suggest that we should artificially inflate ratings, but do you think that the system is stacked against consumer expectation? I'd love to hear from you.
You bring up a great point and so does your girlfriend. If the ratings is going to hurt your profession, change your name on here. Note, removing the photos doesn't affect your ratings....I think..I'm pretty sure.
Thanks for taking some time to provide feedback. I had never thought of it the way she brought it up, but it was the first thing she thought of. I think it's worth the community talking about. I don't want to remove photos or "game the system" because I like my portfolio and I want honest feedback, but I hadn't considered the 2nd order effects.
Hmm yeah this is an interesting point, thanks for the food for thought...
Thanks for reading!
Matthew, you bring up several good points.
I too have been thinking about the problem of simplistic rating systems (not just in FS but in social media over all) and how they relate to a very complex and the hyper-personal art form we call photography.
Alas the busnes of social media is NOT about the content but about getting people to generate content and participate to attract more users and leveraging their participation for the sites financial gain.
Period.
As to the 5star system used here or likes or luvs or or or systems used elsewhere..... just some gimmick to get site users to engage and generate content.
Nothing more.
As with anything you do in life it all comes down to the quality of your work, the way you treat your team, clients, those around you, and hooah.
Your images speak for them selves!
I would play here but put all your seriousness into YOUR website (18echomedia.com), brand, and business.
FS is just entertainment!
Make it support your brand!
BTW.... good work Matthew. Keep it up.
That is a very good observation! Unfortunately the google search engine doesn't change just by changing a page. There are all these bots and bugs and stuff that I think will maintain the history of you for a long time after a change.
Totally agreed. The debate (in my mind) is more about whether having a rated portfolio on Fstoppers could actually be a detriment in the eyes of potential clients who may get the wrong impression of your capability based upon the way the numbering system works.
There's not much I can do about it now, after the fact.
Don’t think so. Unless a person is pretty well known / recognizable, people will go to IG or the website you provide them. Maybe change your name and image if your that concerned.
Changing name and images won't affect google or the Fstoppers rating you currently have. The algorithms involved take a LONG time to update search results. I do agree if someone is searching so specific they are searching your name then they already have your contact and website. It is alarming though when the first listing on google shows 3 out of 5:)
thank you for sharing this...
1-- how long you been active on Fstoppers?
2-- ru serious? is this really the culture?
--> "here on Fstoppers we have a system where the highest rating I've ever seen is 4.3 and most hover very near the 2.5-3.5 range out of 5 even with great work" & "Not only is it difficult to get higher ratings as the upper tier is so subjective, there are far more people who will vote you a 1 for an unfavored comment, an attempt to game a contest or other reason, than who will ever give you a 5 for being a nice person."
I agree with your observation. I think the point has been made several times but with no real response from the team.
I doubt the system will ever change for few reasons:
1. This is how people work: it is easier to tell what you don't like than what you like.
2. Maybe FS team doesn't think our profiles here are as valuable as we think?
3. Probably they focus more on getting free content and sell tutorials than improving basic rating system.
I have a phrase "If you rate under 3 stars, please give feedback so I know where to improve." on my profile page and yet: no one has ever given any feedback in these cases.
Totally agree with your conclusion
As in all platforms unfortunately people will sometimes not rate the photo on its merit this has always been and will probably always be
I see so many average photos on here being rated 4-5 star and many excellent photos being rate 2-3 star