When Nikon first started with their teasers, there was a lot of excitement. Many people were intrigued about the larger lens mount and the potential for super-wide-aperture lenses. The excitement now seems to be fading and the reality of Nikon's mirrorless system is starting to set in.
It wasn't very long ago that Nikon and Canon shooters were mockingly pointing at Sony cameras: terrible battery life, the single card slot, and an ineffective focus system. It would seem like Nikon has inherited these flaws. In their latest video, Tony and Chelsea Northrup describe their first impressions using the Nikon Z6 and Z7 mirrorless cameras. Although the cameras they tested were pre-production models, the initial impressions are not great. Nikon really needed a home run with this camera, and so far, we're not seeing that. The Z6 and Z7 were supposed to be mirrorless versions of the Nikon D850 and the D750; instead, they seem like the less professional, more expensive option. The issue I'm seeing is that I can't seem to think of any reason why someone would want to buy the Z7 over the D850 and adapt F-mount lenses. Sure, you can shoot with native, but the price point makes things relatively difficult. In any case, the advice from Tony and Chelsea is that you may want to wait a little before ordering yours.
Check out the full video to see how these cameras perform.
Sorry Tony, but you make up facts in your videos. Why when you do not need to? How are we to believe you when truth does not seem to matter to you? You loose all credibility because of that.
On the camera, DP Review had it for two days and came to a far different conclusion than you did. Do we believe someone who had for two days versus someone who had it for a few hours?
Well, DPReview is praising the camera of being groundbreaking because has a new mount. But they're not going deep into the 5.5 fps with AE calculation, or how the 12 and 9 fps are with 12 bit compressed (so, sony wasn't that bad, eh)
Also, how a battery with 2000 mah achieves a cipa rating closer to what Sony did with a 1080mAh rather than what Sony is doing with the Z battery?
I'm not saying I don't trust DP review but if you are going to compare credibility it's quite a laugh that you put down an independent content creator and educator versus a company owned by Amazon who wants you to buy the reviewed gear from them.
I had no idea. I just looked it up and you're right they're owned by Amazon.
Interesting.
DP reviews points were pretty much the same as everyone else's, they were just less emotional about it which makes sense being they aren't writing from the perspective of a photographer needing to rely on a particular camera system for their work. They liked the new mount, build quality, feel of the body and buttons, viewfinder. They thought the autofocus was fast in good light but may suffer in dim light due to the way it stops the lens down. They had concerns about the lack of touch focus on the rear LCD, the single card slot, and the possibly weak battery. These are the same issues almost everyone who has used the camera has mentioned. They also praised the grip as being big enough for your whole hand but in several videos I've seen of people holding it they had one or two fingers off the grip.
Just one word about that video from Tony : lame !
Really a bad video, with poor mocking remarks, even if arguments have ground and may be really problematic, the tone is so arrogant and suffisant it should put both to shame instead to be proud of that video.
I read DPreview, watched theirs videos on that Nikon MILC, they were mostly positiive for sure.
But they had fun. But here in this video from that youtuber influencer, we just get lousy jokes, mean words and bad attitude.
Even worse, they don't have the final product in their hands. And they are defending themselves they are just defending the 'customers'... Hey guys and girls, just try to buy humility in a shop.
I never felt in love with thoses praised video unboxers, things are getting even worse now they are earning money and large chunks of visibility...
True Dat'.
And....I don't see any Nikon "beta testers" complaining very much. In fact I'm rather enjoying the sample images so far. Anyone seen Matthew Jordan Smith's recent work?
Some nice stuff.
Don't ever trust a YouTuber, never, not once, not ever.
I don't think I've read something as silly as your comment in a long time. What a nonsense distinction to make between people lol.
Seems a stretch to headline a single review "Initial Reviews for Nikon Mirrorless Are Not Good". Perhaps you could have linked to another handful of reviews before declaring things "not good". As far as I can tell the camera tech community had already decided this camera would be crap before it was even released anyway. I'd be more interested in what regular photographers thought about it.
I disagree...he's spot on.
The initial reviews "from the usual suspects" are not good. Most of them don't appear to be working photographers...professional reviewers more like.
Considering that other video reviewers have similar takes as Tony & Chelsea, it does not bode well for Nikon. Two things, the buildup to the release by Nikon was quite optimistic and secondly, and this is the big one, the price of the 7 does not match what is offered, not by quite a margin.
I've mentioned before that the final verdict can't be rendered until production models hit the reviewer's hands, but so far, it's been a disappointing intro. It will REALLY help Nikon if their adapter is as seamless as advertised, but if it's not, there's going to be a lot of long faces amongst the Nikon faithful.
The title of the headline is literally true. These are the initial reviews I didn't say real word or hands-on or anything to that extent. The initial reviews, that's what I discussed and they are genuinely not great.
The title is clickbait, pure and simple. DP Review actually got to have the camera for two days and their conclusion was far different. Who would you believe, someone who had the camera for two days or two hours?
DP Review had the same problems we did. Even in sunlight they had focus tracking problems.
DP Review said and I am quoting "The Z 7 offers impressive autofocus performance, but there's some adjustments to be made." The two hours that you had with the camera, were you able to make those adjustments?
Good job guys. I know you are honest about what you think and say it.
This. And like the Northrups, DP Review did lay out the caveat that it was based on pre-production model performance. What's so controversial about that? In my opinion it's obvious that the Northrups were interested in providing an honest review. It takes a lot more courage to kick the tires than jump on the bandwagon.
They were provided a pre-production camera to review, they reviewed it honestly.
I'm a Nikon fan. My cameras have always been Nikons. I've been waiting for years for Nikon to come out with a good mirrorless option to my D750. All Nikon had to do was come out with something that was on par with the A7III. They didn't. Even when they release the "production" models, they still won't be because no matter how good they are, they still will only have one card slot.
The only reason I would buy one of these cameras over Sony, is if I'd be already invested in a lot of F-mount glass. On the other hand, there are very few reasons to buy any of these over D850.
Yup if you have lots of F mount glass just buy DSLR, these cameras and lenses are not very compelling right now.
This is a clueless article by two clueless photographers. Sorry, but the firmware/software isn't complete, which means you can't make any conjecture on battery life, focusing, or anything else software related. I blame Nikon for allowing pre-production units to be reviewed.
It's now on pre-order meaning Nikon thought these cameras were fit enough to persuade people to buy early. I nor Tony and Chelsea decided on when and how to demo a camera for pre-order, that's Nikon. Reviewers can only describe how the camera performs and if Nikon hasn't taken the time to fully develop the software that's their fault. They're literally trying to get people to buy their stuff and the reviewers are saying wait because it doesn't look great right now. I don't understand how you wouldn't get behind that considering how it's in your best interests.
Card slots can't be multiplied with firmware and the battery capacity can't increase. We might see slightly better battery life if they can make the software more efficient but not anywhere close to where Nikon DSLRs operate or where Sony mirrorless do.
There is CIPA rating on battery and my guess is that will not change.
I see that the one card slot has not stopped you from using a Phase One in your work.
I have mentioned that to Phase One a bunch of times now and hopefully they get it together. I actually avoid using it for that reason on many high end shoots.
You invested in Phase One and avoid using it?
What competent business can have significant quanties of capital not generating revenue?
Edit: I'm still completely stunned by this. I can't help but wonder whether you retired with, or inherited a lot of money and are just running a photography business to occupy your time.
That's nearly $50k US (I'm assuming the XF and 80mm Schneider) of capital you have just shelved.
Although I think every camera should have two slots most users of Phase One cameras are using them in a studio setting and shooting tethered so having one card isn't the same issue as a camera that is small and lightweight and designed to be used in the field and at events.
Well said!
I'm sorry, but you're almost wrong, those camera's have been put thru cipa ratings and are going to ship mostly as they're. The firmware number 0.5 could be 0.9 because it's totally arbitrary how you name the software. The only consensus is that below 1.0 you're not releasing, but you could very well release a 1.0 with the same 0.5 code (that's what will most likely happen)
Manufacturers say preproduction only to cover their asses because if there's some flaw they didn't discover or a strange quirk that could be very hard to repeat and fix they had their bases covered.
After some thinking. Our expectations are skewed by the release of the a7r3 and the a7(3). The a7riii came out in Oct 2017, A7iii April 2018. Where Nikon was in current developments and competing with the a7r2 and a7(2). If you compare the Z series with those. Nikon "wins" all day and nobody would be complaining.
Consumers are expecting Nikon R&D to completely change their whole camera in under a year. That is completely unrealistic because you have to change everything from the body, circuit board, even the factories they are made in. If you compare to the a7(3), which everyone is. That would give Nikon only 5 months to change everything, again unrealistic.
Our expectations are warranted but unrealistic if you actually think about the engineering of developing a camera.
You're correct; Nikon users were hoping for a home run in the first at bat. Sony's initial offerings in the FF market were pretty weak and they were pillaried for it. It took three iterations to get some good cameras to the market.
The problem for Nikon is can their first attempt hold their current user base until v2 comes out (I'm speaking of the 7 specifically)? The one thing that can hold many, and I mentioned this above, is if the adapter is successful.
Again, this is based on pre-production models. How much better will the real cameras be? We can only hope that Nikon has a couple of firmware updates to make it a bit better.
And, they have the D850 and D5, both at the top of the food chain from where I stand, and I'm a Canon shooter.
Speaking about the adapter. I would look to the teleconverters that are currently out. Is there an AF issue? No/Yes? This would be a good way to judge AF reliability.
Good question. The difference I see is that the adapter has no purpose other than to connect the electronics where as the teleconverter has the added function of making the focal length longer. I have the latest iteration of the 1.4 from Canon (v3) and it works very well.
I can't imagine that Nikon would make the adapter less than very good. If it isn't, they're going to have a problem, but if it works, it will keep at least a good amount of Nikon faithful from jumping ship.
Exactly!
I don’t disagree with most of what you’ve written. You are right that a lot of Nikon shooters had unrealistic expectations. It would be extremely difficult if not impossible for Nikon to release a better camera than the competition in the first go round. But, people are people and they hold out hope. However, I don't think people are/were expecting Nikon to change their whole production process in less than a year. As you stated, that would be rather unrealistic. What I do think people thought was Nikon had been preparing for this change for years (and very well should have) and were ready to capitalize on it.
Nikon said a few months back (after the A7r3 was out) that these camera would be a significant jump ahead of existing mirrorless FF cameras.
If you're going to talk the talk, you have to walk the walk.
Link
https://nikonrumors.com/2017/07/08/nikons-president-confirms-new-mirrorl...
https://nikonrumors.com/2011/01/21/flashback-nikon-mirrorless-camera-wil...
You said “Nikon said a few months back (after the A7r3 was out)”
Link 1 - July 2017
Link 2 - January 2011
Sony a7riii - Oct 2017
Sony a7 iii - April 2018
Your statement and link don’t align.
Nikon announces development of 'industry-leading' full-frame mirrorless system
https://www.dpreview.com/news/6307714457/nikon-announces-development-of-...
Nikon is easily the most arrogant camera maker. There was also an article from last Spring I can't find where a manager bragged how this camera would "jump ahead" the competition.
Nevertheless, in order to be "industry-leading" one must actually be ahead, correct? And they're not.
So my original point stands. They developed the Z system to best the Sony Gen 2 and they did that. Nikon had no idea what hit them when Gen 3 came around and it was way to late to make changes. Takes way too much time to redesign, change inner circuitry, body, firmware. Test, beta test, quality control. Change their factory setup. If they did that you would not be seeing a Nikon mirrorless camera in 2018 but more like 2020. If Sony happened to wait one year. Nikon Z would be praised right now.
That DP review article was from last month. Lol! "Industry leading...if it were 2016."
It’s called marketing. You expect a company that found out during the final testing stages they were screwed to say "hey we didn’t hit the mark" as their presser? Think. They have to stay positive. You are obviously not understanding my original point.
It's not really the same though. Nikon shouldn't have designed to match targets that were already in the market, they should have targeted where they thought the target would be at the time of the Z's release. It's a big problem for Nikon because Sony has a faster release schedule than Nikon so if Nikon is now just matching Sony's previous bodies on a lot of their functionality what's it going to look like when Sony comes out with their fourth iteration in one to two years and Nikon is now behind another one to two years? Nikon should really have stated the Z6 is a d610 equivalent and the Z7 a d750 equivalent (and also should have put two slots in it), then they should have put a Z8 on the roadmap for a year or two down the line that was a true 800 series equivalent.
They didn't match, they went past what Sony currently had. Go do a side by side spec comparison between Gen 2 and Z. If this was released last year. We wouldn't have that much complaints beside not having two card slots. People would rejoice at the spec sheet compared to Gen 2. You have to remove all thoughts of the Gen 3 because it wasn't out during the R&D of Z. Z was developed during Gen 2. Though they are not that different than Gen 3 they just made the same mistakes as Sony. No dual card slots, FPS, AF reliability, and battery life. Other than that specs are pretty much the same against the Gen 3.
You have to also remember that A) those are pre-production cameras reviewed by all reviewers and, more importantly, B) Tony and Chelsea are Canon people first and foremost. So when the Canon full frame mirrorless cameras come out, it may not be too surprising to find these two Ga-Ga'd over those machines.
I'm pretty sure they use Nikon cameras more. They went pretty "ga ga" over the D850 as did I and many other people. If a camera is good it's good if it performs bad that's what's going to come out.
They use whatever they want. From what I remember Chelsea/Tony like the D850 for portraits. Tony loves the 5dsr for wildlife. They go back and forth. Definitely not loyal to one brand.
They also speak pretty highly of Sony cameras. It actually doesn't make any sense for them to post videos like this from a financial standpoint. They make money from people using their affiliate links to buy gear.
And you, a Canon shooter.