Ok, so we've covered why you should love the Creative Cloud: it gives you access to everything Adobe everywhere you go. It gives you all the outstanding programs at your fingertips. It is taking connectivity to a whole new level for creative collaboration. Updates are instantaneous. But all that aside, it's a stifling, expensive system that might be forcing you into something you don't want.
1) You're only renting the software.
Adobe applications have become what many of us hate about other situations like internet service or rental housing: monthly payments. Worst yet, you no long can say you own the products. What happens if you can no longer afford the pricing, or what if Adobe arbitrarily increases pricing in the future? You can't combat it. You're trapped.
2) It's all or nothing Sorry, my mistake. The real issue is dropping the ability to invest.
There are thousands, hundreds of thousands even, of Adobe customers who only use one program. Lightroom, Photoshop, whatever, they don't need access to Illustrator. They have no idea how to use nor any intention of learning how to use After Effects. What the heck is Speed Grade? Ok, if you want photoshop you CAN buy it by itself, but it's $20 a month. There are CC full subs that are that price, and even at full price that's nearly half the cost of just getting everything. Not really all that appetizing. Plus, there are those of us who really like to buy software and keep it for 8 or 10 years. Can't do that here. No more investing in software, and that has a lot of people miffed.
3) After paying for the subscription for years, in the end you have nothing to show for that investment.
Let's say you buy the software subscription today and continue for the next three years. That's a large investment, and in the end you'll have spent a couple grand and have nothing to show for it. That's an uncomfortable thought.
4) You won't have access to your own files if you end your subscription.
We create thousands of gigabytes of data yearly, much of this data saved as Adobe proprietary file types. You stop paying a monthly fee, you can't access those files. In the past, at least you could open them without fear, even if the software was outdated. Now? Not the case. You pay, or you lose your process. What that comes down to is there is no way to really exit from Adobe. You're, again, trapped.
UPDATE: For those of you who misunderstand point 4, it has nothing to do with the end files you make, but everything to do with the proprietary formats like .psd or .ai. You can't open those files without Adobe programs. That's the issue.
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I think the biggest mistake Adobe has made thus far is ignoring that group that only wants one piece of the software and not the whole suite. There are a lot of creatives who buy software and keep it forever. For them, the CC is exorbitantly more expensive. It's a really tough situation and one where, amongst the folks I've talked about this with, we think Adobe is really missing the mark. There are a lot of angry people out there because people hate feeling forced into things they don't want. They can't invest. That's the real issue.
What other reasons can you think of to dislike the new Adobe Creative Cloud? Will any of you defend it?
why would people who STEAL photoshop currently when they're going to just keep on STEALING IT? they don't care if the price goes up or down THEY ARE STEALING IT! derr! there will be a torrent with the cc apps (yes all of them) just like there are now ones out there with the master collection. this in no way impact piracy of the software. If you think it does, then well your one .....(insult redacted).....
Alex, Would you not rather choose when and how you invest your hard earned money. Adobe gets your money quicker to invest you lose the opportunity to invest and save longer term! Are you really getting more for less, how much are you losing by not investing your subscription fee in the way you want, before purchase? Its denying you the opportunity to invest your money elsewhere should you wish while waiting for a product upgrade. You are not buying a service, your buying a product with no support and no customer service. I'd rather save the cost of the upgrade on a monthly basis and deceide when I am going to take out my invested money and spend this on the features I feel I'll benefit from.
I can't even begin to state what bad logic this is.
This is on point with what I was thinking as well. I'm not a professional user of the Adobe suite, however I do use After Effects and Photoshop OCCASIONALLY. Not a daily, or even a weekly thing. Sometimes only once a month. Well, I'm not going to subscribe to a service for an application I may or may not use occasionally. It just sucks! That being said, I have no huge problem just keeping the versions I have now, although it will suck not having the newer features.
I will miss you Adobe!
From a college student who doesn't need a pro suite daily.
I am not sold on the CC thing, but there is one advantage to occasional users.
If you only have a couple of projects a year, you can sign on for a month then cancel. Thus only renting the new versions for a month.
I do not think (I could be wrong) that all the plans require extended subscriptions.
But after you finish the project then you can't access it again since you stopped the subscription. Not really a realistic scenario. You also may need to use the software at an unexpected time, or you may need to train with it.. you may take a picture that day and want to edit it... There are many reasons to need fulltime access to your tools even though you may not use them "regularly". That's why people buy software licenses so they know they'll have access to it when they need... even if it's a whole year between uses. Subscription requires you to constantly spend money on something just in case you need it and without being able to have something to use in your downtime when you have to spend money on other things.
If this were rent-to-own then it would be a good deal but it's not. You have to pay money regardless if you use the tool or not.
Some people use older versions of programs because that is all they NEED. People who have been using PS for a decade or more know this is a bad deal because they realize all these new features aren't worth upgrading for if the program they bought many years ago filled their needs then and still does now. Is a new filter or UI change worth Hundreds? To many people it's not. They spent their money once and that is all they need. They don't want to constantly spend money on something they could have already paid for that does what they need.
I joined a month ago. So far, so good. Though I am a bit leery. Have to say though that #3 isn't really true. You DO have something to show for it. All the work you did and all the money you made creating that work.
Well except for the fact you have files you cant fully access you lose all work you've done on those files and anything thats not saved out in finished format is garbage that you may as well delete
As a consumer, you vote with your wallet. If enough people don't buy into this gimmick, they will send a loud message to Adobe - Don't rail road your customers into monthly contracts they don't want, purely out of profit maximization!
From what I've seen in the comments section of the majority of sites like this, Adobe have managed to piss off easily 80% plus of their base with this new business model. I for one hope it falls flat on its face and they quit trying to squeeze more money out of people.
this is no misinformation you clown.. these are facts.
Misinformation? Tell me what I got wrong and I'll get right on it.
"Let’s say you buy the software subscription today and continue for the next three years... in the end you’ll have spent a couple grand and have nothing to show for it."
Photoshop ($20/mnth) over 3 years would cost you 720$ (not thousands) which is also the cost of one previous boxed version of Photoshop which would be woefully outdated at that time.
Software isn't an investment. By definition an investment is an asset or item that is purchased with the hope that it will generate income or appreciate in the future. Software is a cost of doing business. Adobe makes software for creative businesses.
I don't have time to correct any more of your post because I have to get back to running my business now. Pretty pictures and righteous anger aren't enough to pay bills in this world, although armchair photographers seem to have at least one of those in spades.
I'm sorry. I couldn't understand your talking points because your arrogance got in the way. Belittling someone, and then saying "I dont have time to tell you why" is just asinine.
There are a lot of photographers who use more than just Photoshop. And how does software not fall under an investment. I purchase software with the hope that what I create in it will generate income. I have also sold old software when I am finished with it on ebay or craigslist.
Also, unrelated, the whole two computer limit install is crap. I have a work computer, home computer, and two laptops. I now have to purchase two licenses to use it.
@merekdavis:disqus :
From Adobe for CS 6:
"2.1.3 Portable or Home Computer Use. Subject to the important restrictions set forth in Section 2.1.4 [having to do with volume licensees], the primary user of the Computer on which the Software is installed … may install a second copy of the Software for his or her exclusive use on either a portable Computer or a Computer located at his or her home, provided that the Software on the portable or home Computer is not used at the same time as the Software on the primary Computer."
You are violating the terms of the CS 6 license if you are installing one copy on "a work computer, home computer, and two laptops." You would have to purchase two full CS 6 licenses to do that.
IT IS ABOUT THE UPGRADE FEE DUMBASS! Stop treating it like you are buying the full version everytime a new version comes out and you see how ridiculous you sound.
Simple
$199 upgrade every 18 months = $11.05 a month with the option to skip an upgrade.
$20 a month for 18 months = $360 and you have to keep paying or you can't use the program that is sitting on YOUR machine. The whole "cloud" term is BS too.
Look at this breakdown and tell me it's THE SAME.
http://www.lenspoden.com/photo-topics/2013/5/7/adobe-creative-cloud-cost...
"Software isn't an investment."
Okay, in technical terms, you are correct, but tell that to every trucking business using the same logistics software for the past 20 yrs. Tell that to law firms who invested in database software in the late 80s. Software has until recently been seen as an asset (which is obviously the technical term for what the author meant) owned by the company that bought it, or at the least a licensed product paid for in a single payment. Either way companies "invest" in software with the intentions of using it until it is useless to them. Just like anything else they purchase.
The new trend is a "leasing license." Like leasing other equipment, it requires continual payment But unlike leasing a physical thing (like a company car which comes with maintenance) the advantages over one time licensing are almost nil for a lot of businesses.
Software is every bit an investment in your business. No software...no business..get it? I can't believe how many amateur businesses are out there.
How is a 3 year old PS woefully outdated? Unless you have some reason to need the latest version because of some artificial obsolescence then a 3 year old version works just fine. You are basically saying CS5 is woefully out of date... WHICH IT IS NOT.
OH and yes... I work at a BUSINESS that uses CS5 and there is NO reason for us to upgrade unless forced.
YES, it IS an investment... it's a TOOL you INVEST in. You use it to train yourself, to create art, to use for hobby interests... you use to to improve your skills, to improve your life and:
"By definition an investment is an asset or item that is purchased with the hope that it will generate income"
How in the world do you think "software" is not something you use to generate income?
People are still going to pirate and find ways to use the software with out paying for it. The issue is its going to cause random people like me that dont mind paying for just photoshop and just lightroom to want to find a cracked illegal copy of the software. This in turn will eat away at the bottom line of adobe. Personally i have no problem at all paying 20 dollars a month to have access to every thing. If it were 20 dollars a month i could see the people who pirate the software right now not stealing it any more but paying for it. In some sense they are going from expensive software to more expensive software since you dont own it. I look forward to seeing what open source and or other companies create to combat this. Personally if apple were to come out with some thing like photoshop that i could just download on the App store i would probably use that.
It's called Acorn, does just about everything that Photoshop does.
LOL, no.
Thanks Jim,
Ill have to look into that !
i don´t use any adobe software. but i like to predict something.
i think it is no question that this CC software will be pirated.
and i predict that a lot of former legal customer will use a warez version in the future!!
I have both perpetual and subscription versions of the Adobe CS6 suite and I still prefer the perpetual licensing. I was out on a shoot in the sticks, had no way of getting internet and because I hadn't opened Premiere on that particular laptop in a few weeks, suddenly it asked me to "reactivate" my program. Problem was, there was no internet. I had to wait until I got back to internet land to open premiere. very frustrating.
Why didn't you just pop in to the local cyber cafe and update using their free wifi?
I'm sure it was entirely just your fault that you couldn't update the program.
It sucks... and here is why :
1) if you don't have bandwidth... you're nothing. 95% of the world has shitty bandwidth and will not be able to get access to the tools... how's that for poor customer service.
2) Cloud, cloud, cloud... I want reality not virtuality everywhere. Get us back to what we pay for. A software we can own, we pay for something not rental... I want to be able to use it for 10 years if i need to as some features of PS 10 were antiquated in latest CS and are way better... good to go back to some tools sometimes.
3) a brush tool, stamp tool, clone tool, layers, etc. have not changed massively and we don't always need the latest updates to do our work... let people decide what they need, allow for multiple ways.
4) Some might love cloud, good for them, give them that option, but don't put down all the others for whom it doesn't work. Electronic downloads with a fast bandwidth, i can install on my multiple computers according to my licence plans. with Cloud... i can't. i have to connect for every single one of them and that can take 10->30 hours per machine... come on, get off it guys.
5) I don't want to rent out a software at that price. i purchase it... i own the right to use it for as long as i want... enough of the controled obsolescence and pushing for stuff i don't want, need, etc.
6) Cloud storage... loads of options out there, why should i be forced to use the adobe one for the package... ? i don't care about cloud storage except for some dropbox etc. which works fine for me for the amount i need to store.
7) subscriptions at 28 CHF = 29 USD... same system, same download, same process, 50% more expensive, Damn joke once again.
8) Using a dominant position on a market, with great tools to work that way makes me sick, I think that's the worst decision taken, and I just hope someone will work on new tools and kick adobe's ass out of that position just for this stinking attitude towards its users.
Hackers will still find a way to bypass the software's security measures, so as always, only loyal customers will be affected at the end of the day.
I think that long forgotten company may very well become a Phoenix rising out of
it's ashes. Corel has the distinct ability to fill in the hole Adobe has
just made. They will need to update their software to some degree, but
Corel has a suite of programs not unlike the Creative Suite. Let's see
if Corel rises to the challenge/opportunity and creates a graphics suite
worthy of replacing the Abobe suite.
Unfortunately, Corel is subscription based now, also.
No, it's an option. You can buy a boxed version as well.
For now. They will not sell boxed versions beyond X6. It will be a subscription based model from here on out. I had a lengthy discussion with them before I signed up. Like it or not, this is the model for the future. First they quit printing manuals and other documentation, then quit selling disk based software, now subscription method. With Corel, it ends up being about the same cost as buying an upgrade every 18 months.
No. I will not do it. It's not worth being a slave to these software tyrants just to make crappy money.
You are apperently unaware that Photoshop is still available as a buy and download as well. If you wish to buy Ps, you still can and always will be able to do so. And I don't mean to subscribe to just Ps. I mean to buy it like you always have been able to do!
You should read Scott Kelby's blog post today. He goes through every and all details. And yes, you are misinformed. But you are not the only one. Go read Scotts' post and re-write this article. Or just pull it completely...
Yes, you can buy CS6 and never expect a single new feature. Which will be fine, until CS6 no longer supports future versions of Camera Raw and it will be permanently handicapped once you get a new camera. Scott Kelby is an Adobe shill. A talented, knowledgeable shill, but a shill non-the-less. His post did nothing to make me hate this concept any less. Most of his points were addressing small issues like single-app subscriptions and when it came to things that legitimately pissed me off, he basically said "tough luck, life's not fair." No Scott, life isn't fair, and Adobe has way more to lose here than I do.
#1 So, take that $1,800 you would have spent and put it in the bank to grow slowly and when you need to pay the rent you pull it out. Nothing has changed in cost except you get more for less and you keep your cash longer. Did you pay for upgrades every year? Every other year? At the CC pricing, you would have to go 3 years on one suite before it became more expensive than buying a box. Meanwhile, Adobe is still sending you the lastest advances for that 3 years.
#2 The pricing is exactly the same as it was when they were selling the suites. If you needed more than two of the tools, it was cheaper to purchase the whole enchilada. Nothing new here. Was this a problem for you then?
#3 You are looking at software as something you collect like a trophy. Software is a tool to get something done. The end result of using the tool is the product – not the tool itself. I don't buy software as an investment. I invest in tools and time to increase my skills in those tools to create a product.
#4 Think about this realistically. Does your old boxed software currently sit on your computer? No, the latest version does and guess what? It opens your 3 year-old files just fine. Worried about compatibility? Save it in an open format. No big deal.
This is really just an updated approach to business. When think about Adobe's changes logically and comparatively, there is not much different than what the last 5 years have been. You are paying the same or less, you are getting a very convenient system with additional services and you can easily move it across computers and platforms. You just have to let go of old mindsets.
I keep my system offline for security reasons. I don't care to plug my system into The Matrix just because Adobe thinks it's figured out a way to keep people from stealing it's software.
LOL. Yes, cs5 running strong here on all the dozens of work computers... with no need to upgrade unless forced.
Enjoy your mandatory subscription fee for perpetual updates you don't need. And enjoy spending thousands and not having a permanent license. After all... it's just a tool you have to use to do the actual job, who cares about actually owning it.
I actually think Adobe's Creative cloud is excellent. It gives me access to the software(s) I need. After a year... if don't need it I can cancel. I agree with the person that said #4 is a little misleading. Thats like being mad at computer manufacturers because you can't access a 3.5 disk. Think ahead, save it to one or more of the other formats that support layers, available in most of the Adobe products. There is no single fstoppers reader / adobe product user that can't go over a friend/associates house/co-op to get gain access to files you need, or you can get a month-to-month membership and access your files. They aren't forcing you to buy into it.. if you already have there products. They are just canning the suites.
My wife is a teacher... I used her email addy and got it for $29.99
So you're saying we should marry teachers and mooch our friend's computers. Basically perfect. :)
Kidding. All we're saying is, there's no good reason that the standard license model and the CC can't coexist, and to eliminate the choice puts a lot of users in a totally avoidable uncomfortable disadvantage. As far as forcing us to buy into it, no, they aren't, but they are leaving those who want a license for their money behind.
Yes... whats life without a little smoochin' and moochin'. I agree they should both be able to coexist. The tone of the article makes it seem like CC is just outright terrible. I feel like there are two plausible outcomes... 1) the backlash will force them to reconsider. 2) Someone else will set up to try and fill the void(s).
That's because it is terrible to pay thousands into a product you can't use anymore because you don't want to continue paying Adobe money into perpetuity.
I hate to be that guy but I've had creative cloud from the beginning. At first I had the same thoughts. But then I realized, for my workflow (I use Premiere, AE, PS, Flash, Fireworks, Illustrator) it is so much cheaper for me to go creative cloud. I realized I have been upgrading every year anyway and as long as I know that Adobe is what I'll be using for years (after Final Cut X, yes) then I don't see the problem. Tack on $20 to your jobs and you should be able to pay for it.
I guess if you don't mind upgrading all the time and not having a permanent license then it's cool.
I can use the extra thousands for other things, but you seem like a true industry worker bee. Me.. well I'm just a small time graphic designer and my measly ad building (for a lousy newspaper... yeah, we should just admit how dead we are) and hobbyist game modding just don't command the same need for the latest and greatest editions of the suite.
Well, as emergency, Inkscape opens ai files, but that's not the point. The point is that you have legally created something you can't access unless you keep your subscription. they should release, at least, permanent legal 'viewers' to the subscriptors.
Probably they will publish viewers for PSD and AI files. Just like they have Acrobat Viewer and probably other viewers too. Just at the moment there is no need for a viewer,
What I hear here is just add the cost onto your job. But what about the thousands of amateur users that have saved like mad to get the software is their dreams. An amateur can't warrant a £20 pm outlay
Then you can get started sooner because it's a cheaper startup cost :)
Then, by your logic, they will also be done way sooner because they can not justify the outlay in continuation. The people he is referring to may have budgeted and saved for many months and also have no intention on upgrading within any reasonable time period. Therefore, they will have these programs for either a short period and no longer be able to justify keeping it or simply avoid it all-together.
There are a multitude of hobbiests out there that simply can not afford to add $50 a month to their budget indefinately since there will be no return upon their investment.